Kansas City Blog

Yes the Grandmaster Flash. The first man ever to use the turntable as an instrument was kind enough to call our headquarters last week to field questions about his life, from the first record he ever cut to what's hot on the dance floor now to his starring role in the new game DJ Hero. Without the pioneering discoveries Flash (born in Barbados as Joseph Saddler and brought up in the Bronx) made in the early '70s experimenting with vinyl records, hip-hop as we know it today would not exist.

Credit: Mo Daoud

His bio puts it best: He was the first DJ to physically lay his hands on the vinyl and manipulate it in a backward, forward or counterclockwise motion, when most DJs simply handled the record by the edges, put down the tone arm, and let it play. Those DJs let the tone arm guide their music, but Flash marked up the body of the vinyl with crayon, fluorescent pen, and grease pencil--and those markings became his compass.

From there, Flash developed an array of techniques he called the Quick Mix Theory (the double-back, back-door, back-spin, phasing, etc.). This led to cutting between two records and scratching. MCs began arriving on Flash's figurative doorstep to rap over his beats, and soon Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five were born and would introduce hip-hop to mainstream culture through songs like "The Message."

Nowadays, the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee remains a vital voice in the world of hip-hop, performing, producing, hosting a Sirius show and interacting on all levels with the musical genre he helped create. Flash recently released The Bridge: Concept of a Culture, his first major studio album in 20 years, but what's got him most excited right now is DJ Hero.

As a working (and request-taking!) DJ, Flash gigs all over the world and will be coming to Kansas City on Friday, July 24, to spin at Mosaic.

We (that is, I) tried not to embarrass ourselves (myself) during a wonderful, 30-minute interview with Grandmaster Flash over the phone as he seemed to be running errands around his home city. Transcript follows.

The Pitch: What was the first record (or records) that you perfected your cutting techniques with?

Grandmaster Flash: There was no one record. Any particular part where the drummer had a moment to play alone was the one that I searched for - when the drummer got to play for 10 seconds or 10 minutes. It could've been a black record, a white record, foreign, American, didn't matter. Karen Young's "Hot Shot," was one of the first ones. Boz Scaggs was probably another. "I'm Gonna Love You a Little" by Barry White -- the drum thing at the beginning. James Brown "Ain't It Funky Now," that incredible bongo part. "Apache," "The Big Beat" by Billy Squier...

When you began using your brand-new DJ methods at parties and clubs, what kind of reaction did you get?

The first time, it was as quiet as you and I when we're not speaking. Why is he doing that? Why is he repeating that? How is he doing that? My theory was if I took the section - pop, rock, jazz, funk, R&B, new, old, foreign or American - if I sort of focused on the musical landscape in the area where the drummer played on for a small amount of time [i.e., the "break"], I would have total positive chaos, but when no one understood it, I was very sad and confused. I cried for a week.

A week?

For sure! At least a week. I couldn't figure it out. I was a kid, you know -- This isn't supposed to be happening.

When Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five formed, there was no template for how a hip-hop group would be successful in the music business. What was it like being one of those first groups?

Soulsonic Force was also successful during that time period. It was interesting. There was no black youth from the hood all of a sudden being catapulted to where it took us. That's quite an interesting vibe. There were some happy times and some not so happy times.

How is DJing a club different today from how it was back when you were getting started?

The one thing I probably miss is changing the records. Now that you have [digital DJ programs] you're using the same piece of vinyl all the time, calling up different MP3 files. That's what's different is changing the vinyl: taking the old pair off and putting a new pair on. Other than that, getting em rockin' like crazy is still all good.

What are your thoughts on the debate between DJ purism versus using something like Serato?

Is there a debate? I use Traktor , but I also carry vinyl. I do both. ... All right, let's say there's some kind of debate. I look at it as an additional convenience. There's also a safety factor as well, because there was a time when I used to carry 10 or 12 crates. These people at the airlines, the baggage handlers, are undisputably the most ruthless people. I say that because I would put all my vinyl in one place, and I would expect it to come out in one piece. I found priceless records in pieces, chipped, cracked, broken in half. There was a big survey on the news a couple of years ago about how baggage was handled, and they showed pics of how these guys handle baggage - they throw it. Even if you put a "fragile" sticker on it, they'll throw it. I've been collecting vinyl for decades, and the last thing I wanna see is a piece of vinyl you can no longer collect cracked. It's protection for my collection, but it's also a convenience. Now I can travel with 10-15,000 records. I'm a servant, so anything you ask me for, I'll have it.

You take requests!?

Yeah! I'm kinda old-fashioned with that, but yeah. I don't allow them to come to me personally. I have people who roll with me that take the requests. You write it on a piece of paper and give it to them, and they'll bring it to me. If I can, I'll work it in. I don't play no fixed pattern, no fixed way. It's too difficult. I'll be in Kansas one minute and the next I'll be in London, so if I played my set one certain way everywhere I go, there'd be a lot of unhappy people.

You have consulted the developers of the game DJ Hero and you even have a starring role in the game itself. Do you think the game will encourage kids to take up DJing?

Absolutely. That's why I even did it. It's because I felt that it's so important. Let me try to make an example: If you have a favorite DJ, you watch the way they spin, you like the way they dance, you support them whenever they're playing. What if I could show you how to do it, how to DJ? If I could, I would think your interest would multiply. We are at an age where sharing is critical.

Take all the four elements of hip-hop: DJing, breakdancing, MCing and graffiti. Breakdancing has been totally understood to the layman through TV, movies - it's a very worldwide, accepted art form. Graffiti artists were considered criminals because they were doing their works of art on buildings. Now they're heroes, almost like Van Gogh. You can see their works in museum. MCs are heroes. You can hear them around world. But the technical aspect of DJing is still a mystery to the layman. You guys love to see it, you love to hear it, you applaud it, but you actually don't know to do it.

For me to be the inventor of the science, for me to be asked to contribute. ... I met with them a year ago. ... At first, I thought they wanted to license my music. They said, "We are the creators of Guitar Hero." I go to meet them, and in the room there is a big box, a mixer and turntable and screen. I say nothing, and one of the four gentlemen steps up and says, "We have this concept, and we really feel like it would be improper to try to put this thing together without you." Guy number two jumps up and goes to a little turntable and mixer and starts to play this file. I'm looking at this and I'm slightly amazed and a little bit confused. It had glitches and pops. It was not perfect.

I say, "Who's gonna be part of the game?" They name big names. I ask what kind of music will they be using. I thought they would use some generic, bullcrap songs -- songs they wouldn't have to clear. Guy three gets up and says here's songs they wanna clear, and they're songs I play in the club, new and old. I ask, "What are you gonna call the techniques in the game? Are you gonna change them to your benefit?" "No, we're gonna keep the techniques just as you invented." Real music, real DJs, keeping techniques just as they were created. ...

And then they asked me to become a character, which was great. ... I made tracks for the game as well. I think of the four elements, the layman needs to know what this is. No more secrets. You should know what this is. Here it is. Me being the creator of the fourth formula, it's now time to know the layman what this is and how we move it back and forth, how we spin it back, why this sounds the way it sounds ... It's important for DJ culture. It's important for history. It's important because the other three elements are already understood.

What are some ways you use the Internet to promote your projects and connect with fans?

Twitter, Facebok, MySpace. Shoot, there's a list, man. And I have people who I have on my staff who do it. I didn't really understand it at first, but my people were like, "People wanna know what you're doing. If you're buying a bag of potato chips in Germany, people wanna know what the brand is. Or if you're having Japanese green tea, they wanna know what kind." I use the Internet. People wanna get closer to me.

How has the demand for downloadable, free music affected the way you market and sell your music?

I guess it would never really be understood, but you spend so much money to put a project together, especially when it's music given to you by a company and you gotta pay that money back. I guess for me, I'm wondering, I don't know if record sales are an issue anymore. I look at [a record] as my business card, to stay viable for today's and tomorrow's market. If I make a record, I know I'm gonna give it away. I don't know anybody who's making money off selling physical records. [Having a record out] supports touring.

Tell us about the overarching concept of your new album The Bridge: Concept of a Culture.

I wanted to make an album that was a mirror of the places that I've been, of the things that I've learned. That kind of sums it up. ... There's underground tracks, commercial tracks, slow tracks, fast tracks, some that have a more foreign or more American sound -- sort of like the way I play a set. That's what it was. I'm already working on the next record, so I was just making a statement. [The new record] should be out probably January. It doesn't have a name yet.

What made you want to release an album right now?

To have some fun, I think. Fun -- that's it. A lot of my friends who are geart producers - Premier, Just Blaze, the Neptunes, Dr. Dre, Diddy -- those are all my friends. These guys have fun doing it. I just wanted to have some fun doing it. Right situation. Timing was good. I did it.

What projects are you working on now that you're excited about?

DJ Hero. I'm every excited about that. It drops October 27. That's my biggest excitement. Now DJ culture gets in the hands of the kid in Kansas, Louisiana, Kensington, England, Africa. My science now will be in the hands of regular people. That's my major excitement.

DJ Jazzy Jeff was recently in town, and it seems like a lot of the founding fathers of hip-hop are touring. Have you always toured like this, or is this a fairly new deal?

I never really had problem touring. I think that we are asked more to tour. I would say yes. I think that America is opening up to the DJ more. At one point it was just about the MC, the rapper. Now DJs get to travel, just DJs. It's great.

Why?

I don't know. Overseas, the DJ is, like, giant, and in America, the MC is giant. There may be four or five of us that tour heavily. I can probably count them on one hand. Which is sad -- there's so many great DJs.

Did you hear about what happened with Jazzy Jeff when he was here?

No.

Well ... [Interviewer gives brief explanation: Alleged disagreement over sound levels, Jeff leaves but feels he's being kicked out for his choice in hip-hop, etc. etc. Grandmaster listens.]

No. Jeff is a perfectionist and a professional, and out of all of us, he's probably the meekest. And a lot of us is hotheads! He's so meek. You can't piss him off. I can't ... Jeff? No way. I can't see him ... Jeff, he knows how to turn it down, no problem. [Cell phone signal is lost for the better part of a minute as Flash continues. When signal is restored, Flash explains that he may lose the connection soon, so we better wrap it up.]

What new record is getting the best reaction at your live gigs?

"Best I Ever Had," by Drake. I'm feeling that right now. Feelin' that a whole lot. It's not my favorite, but right now, it's the hot joint.

What classic record is everyone still into?

So many, man. I been collecting records for 35 years. I wouldn't know where to start. What they like in Kansas, they might hate in Japan. What they hate in England, they might like in the Bronx.

Hip-hop music is still only about old as your career has been long. Do you have a vision of what hip-hop might be like, say, in the 2070s?

The four elements: breakdancer, DJ, MC and graffiti artist. As far as I can go.